WEBVTT

1
00:00:09.880 --> 00:00:17.140
Tonight, the Junior League of Chicago incorporated in cooperation with Station WTTW is the first

2
00:00:17.140 --> 00:00:22.100
in a series of four programs entitled The Wise of Wise Parenthood.

3
00:00:22.880 --> 00:00:27.880
This series will consist of unrehearsed group discussions of the normal problems arising

4
00:00:27.880 --> 00:00:29.480
in everyday family life.

5
00:00:30.140 --> 00:00:35.420
The particular subject for tonight is Why the Father, for which fathers only have been

6
00:00:35.420 --> 00:00:37.800
invited to participate in our studio discussion.

7
00:00:38.780 --> 00:00:43.520
In addition to the studio participants, many home discussion groups have been formed to

8
00:00:43.520 --> 00:00:47.440
watch and to carry on their own discussion of tonight's subject at the close of this

9
00:00:47.440 --> 00:00:48.020
program.

10
00:00:48.380 --> 00:00:54.120
Leading the group discussion here is Dr. Herbert Ratner, Public Health Director, Oak Park,

11
00:00:54.120 --> 00:00:59.380
and Associate Clinical Professor of Preventive Medicine and Public Health at the Stritch

12
00:00:59.380 --> 00:01:00.580
School of Medicine.

13
00:01:01.200 --> 00:01:07.200
Dr. Ratner has since 1951 conducted group discussions in his own community on family

14
00:01:07.200 --> 00:01:11.720
and parent-child relationships similar to the discussion which is now in progress.

15
00:01:12.420 --> 00:01:17.220
The opinions expressed on tonight's program are those of Dr. Ratner and members of the

16
00:01:17.220 --> 00:01:21.840
discussion group and not necessarily those of the Junior League of Chicago incorporated.

17
00:01:21.840 --> 00:01:23.780
What else is on tonight?

18
00:01:26.820 --> 00:01:33.560
And I suppose I should first make it clear, in fairness to the mothers of the metropolitan

19
00:01:33.560 --> 00:01:41.980
Chicago area and with our personal family friends, that any opinions expressed tonight

20
00:01:41.980 --> 00:01:46.260
by us fathers are not necessarily those of our wives.

21
00:01:47.600 --> 00:01:49.780
The mothers will have their turn next week.

22
00:01:49.780 --> 00:01:54.760
I only hope that I'll be able to get a disclaimer out of them, at least we don't want to be

23
00:01:54.760 --> 00:02:00.680
talking of a disclaimer so that they're not talking for husbands, at least not on television.

24
00:02:02.080 --> 00:02:06.260
The other thing I want to assure you about is that you don't have to have any fears about

25
00:02:06.260 --> 00:02:12.780
talking tonight because the studio is well guarded and you are fully protected from any

26
00:02:12.780 --> 00:02:16.200
and all infuriated or infatuated women.

27
00:02:16.880 --> 00:02:22.420
Of course, Count Eleven wants to make it clear that once you leave the air, you're on your

28
00:02:22.420 --> 00:02:23.880
own, they have no responsibility.

29
00:02:24.600 --> 00:02:32.560
Now most of you are strangers to me, I presume you already know my name, and I want to make

30
00:02:32.560 --> 00:02:35.720
it clear the kind of discussion we're dealing with.

31
00:02:36.600 --> 00:02:42.040
I am a discussion leader but I am not a person trying to tell you what to do.

32
00:02:42.760 --> 00:02:48.620
We are here kind of pooling our collective experiences, trying to unearth our common

33
00:02:48.620 --> 00:02:55.720
sense and collectively we are hoping to come out with some insights that come out of our

34
00:02:55.720 --> 00:03:02.620
experience so we can get something that is really going to help us and others and our

35
00:03:02.620 --> 00:03:05.720
problems with children.

36
00:03:06.460 --> 00:03:14.920
Actually, instead of you asking me questions, with me acting as the expert, I'm really asking

37
00:03:14.920 --> 00:03:16.680
you questions tonight.

38
00:03:17.040 --> 00:03:27.780
Here is to help you tackle this problem and to move it along, to get us on the air, to

39
00:03:27.780 --> 00:03:34.340
get us off the air and to have some kind of an orderly movement in between.

40
00:03:37.200 --> 00:03:43.680
The real measure of this discussion tonight, of course, is not going to be us.

41
00:03:45.920 --> 00:03:55.080
As I say, I'm not here as an expert, I can't really be the judge of the right thing.

42
00:03:55.080 --> 00:04:03.120
The real judge of this discussion is reality, the real nature of things, the real nature

43
00:04:03.120 --> 00:04:06.940
of the family, the experience of mankind.

44
00:04:07.560 --> 00:04:21.320
It's as if we were a panel of male red robins and one of us said, heck, or peck, why does

45
00:04:21.320 --> 00:04:24.380
mama have to be setting on the eggs all day long?

46
00:04:26.720 --> 00:04:32.360
Now obviously all of the birdwatchers in the country and the ornithologists, you don't know

47
00:04:32.360 --> 00:04:36.380
what ornithology is, there's a course in biology that they give early in the week on this program,

48
00:04:37.520 --> 00:04:40.580
all know that we don't know what we're talking about, see?

49
00:04:40.840 --> 00:04:45.000
And as a matter of fact, we don't know what we're talking about because when we ask why

50
00:04:45.000 --> 00:04:50.380
is mama setting on the eggs all day long, we don't really know what a robin is all about.

51
00:04:51.400 --> 00:04:57.300
Now there are two final points I want to make and make very clear to you, that we're not

52
00:04:57.300 --> 00:05:00.160
here tonight to solve individual problems.

53
00:05:03.860 --> 00:05:10.640
We may with an occasional father have him describe a concrete situation, but solely

54
00:05:10.640 --> 00:05:19.020
the purpose of getting out of that situation those principles that apply to all children.

55
00:05:20.160 --> 00:05:25.680
We have to realize that really nobody can tell a parent what to do.

56
00:05:26.740 --> 00:05:28.300
A parent is on the spot.

57
00:05:29.320 --> 00:05:34.560
God has seen to it, and if you don't believe in God, the forces of nature has seen to it,

58
00:05:34.560 --> 00:05:43.560
that every child has his own individual, personal, private set of parents, because this is what

59
00:05:43.560 --> 00:05:45.740
a child needs, see?

60
00:05:46.940 --> 00:05:53.580
He needs the understanding that only the person close to him can have, because each child

61
00:05:53.580 --> 00:05:57.020
is different even though there are essential differences.

62
00:05:57.020 --> 00:06:04.300
And the other thing I want you to realize tonight is that let us not expect miracles

63
00:06:04.300 --> 00:06:10.660
in a 45 or a 50 minute discussion when we're talking about such a profound question as

64
00:06:10.660 --> 00:06:11.600
why the father.

65
00:06:12.260 --> 00:06:17.100
It really would take hours to get down below the surface of this question.

66
00:06:17.780 --> 00:06:21.220
We may not come up with any significant part of the question.

67
00:06:21.260 --> 00:06:24.700
We certainly won't come up with any significant part of the answer.

68
00:06:24.700 --> 00:06:27.280
We won't certainly come up with all the answers.

69
00:06:27.600 --> 00:06:33.140
We certainly, we probably might not come up with part of the good answers.

70
00:06:33.480 --> 00:06:35.260
We will come up with answers.

71
00:06:35.620 --> 00:06:43.320
But I think what is a miracle tonight is that you and many others are taking an hour off,

72
00:06:43.960 --> 00:06:51.440
an hour more off from your busy lives to really reflect on why the father.

73
00:06:52.060 --> 00:06:57.060
Aristotle has pointed out that wonder is the beginning of knowledge.

74
00:06:58.300 --> 00:07:02.760
And if you don't stop to wonder, you will never end up with knowledge.

75
00:07:03.320 --> 00:07:07.720
The question, as you know, is father to the answer.

76
00:07:08.160 --> 00:07:11.940
Of course, next week on why the mothers will make it the mother of the answer.

77
00:07:12.900 --> 00:07:27.480
But we have to take off time in this busy culture of ours to raise the right questions,

78
00:07:27.840 --> 00:07:31.920
face them, and do some thinking and talking about it.

79
00:07:32.020 --> 00:07:36.680
And that is really of only salvation in this matter.

80
00:07:37.320 --> 00:07:45.940
Now, to get you into the mood of the question, we are going to show you a 99-second film clip.

81
00:07:46.500 --> 00:07:50.580
And immediately following it, we will face the question of the evening.

82
00:08:02.600 --> 00:08:05.400
Everyone knows what a little baby is like.

83
00:08:05.860 --> 00:08:07.920
Charming, helpless, and appealing.

84
00:08:08.820 --> 00:08:10.900
Your father and mother know it too, Michael.

85
00:08:11.500 --> 00:08:13.880
They don't expect you to be anything else.

86
00:08:20.040 --> 00:08:26.180
And then you start to grow up, Michael, and there's a wonderful excitement about every new thing.

87
00:08:27.200 --> 00:08:29.960
Well, about almost every new thing.

88
00:08:31.820 --> 00:08:36.040
There are some new things that don't quite fit with your mother's dream.

89
00:08:40.840 --> 00:08:45.180
You're growing up now, and you don't like to be cuddled all the time.

90
00:08:46.800 --> 00:08:48.620
He never lets me hold him anymore.

91
00:08:53.020 --> 00:08:55.600
Michael, take that dirty thing out of your mouth.

92
00:08:56.440 --> 00:08:58.380
Let him alone. He's growing up.

93
00:08:59.260 --> 00:09:03.760
And very often, Michael, the things you do, the things every baby does,

94
00:09:03.760 --> 00:09:06.800
don't always fit in with your father's dream either.

95
00:09:18.060 --> 00:09:21.920
Does he have to be so messy about it? Here, let me feed him.

96
00:09:26.980 --> 00:09:27.160
Eat.

97
00:09:31.700 --> 00:09:36.000
Let him alone, Daniel. He's just a baby.

98
00:09:39.920 --> 00:09:42.900
First, father says, let him alone. He's growing up.

99
00:09:43.040 --> 00:09:45.780
And then mother says, let him alone. He's just a baby.

100
00:09:46.260 --> 00:09:47.780
Why don't they let you alone?

101
00:09:48.640 --> 00:09:50.840
Each of them has a dream about what he wants.

102
00:09:52.420 --> 00:10:00.180
Well, boys, we've showed you that little film clip so you can recognize and identify yourselves as fathers.

103
00:10:00.860 --> 00:10:05.720
And so I put before you the question of the evening, why the father?

104
00:10:06.240 --> 00:10:08.820
The $64,000 question of the nation.

105
00:10:10.800 --> 00:10:13.800
And what thoughts do you have on this? Yes, sir?

106
00:10:14.040 --> 00:10:19.380
Well, Dr. Ravner, you brought out the point when you said each child has his own private set of parents.

107
00:10:19.380 --> 00:10:26.840
And I believe that a male parent and a female parent really seem to complement each other.

108
00:10:27.300 --> 00:10:30.740
They're both necessary. And being so entirely different,

109
00:10:32.800 --> 00:10:38.140
I believe they're entirely necessary. The father is as necessary as the mother.

110
00:10:39.380 --> 00:10:41.180
Well, what way is the father necessary?

111
00:10:42.140 --> 00:10:46.000
I mean, we can grant the biological fact and we all understand this.

112
00:10:46.580 --> 00:10:47.080
Yes, sir?

113
00:10:47.080 --> 00:10:50.980
Well, I think the first thing would be he has to support the family.

114
00:10:51.600 --> 00:10:56.680
He has to support the family. You mean give him a board and lodging.

115
00:10:56.820 --> 00:11:01.460
I want you to remember that this is what Alcatraz offers, not only for childhood, but for life.

116
00:11:01.720 --> 00:11:04.940
You know, Alcatraz is the Joliette State prison.

117
00:11:05.740 --> 00:11:11.100
And so we have to, though we recognize this is important, I want you to go on.

118
00:11:12.360 --> 00:11:17.360
Well, let's see. First, to support the family and that's to prepare the child.

119
00:11:18.480 --> 00:11:23.140
And to prepare the child to go ahead in life so that he will be ready to take his place.

120
00:11:23.620 --> 00:11:26.720
To support another family, yes, the humdrum existence.

121
00:11:30.300 --> 00:11:33.940
Well, I think the child comes into the world a blank.

122
00:11:35.100 --> 00:11:37.020
A blank? Don't tell that to a mother.

123
00:11:38.580 --> 00:11:42.780
Well, a blank mind as far as society and adjustment is concerned.

124
00:11:43.000 --> 00:11:45.540
I would, possibly I'm not expressing this right.

125
00:11:45.560 --> 00:11:46.520
Yes, show me.

126
00:11:46.940 --> 00:11:53.220
And I think that both the father and the mother give the child a basis to identify themselves with.

127
00:11:53.380 --> 00:11:55.940
I mean, for example, and this would come out later,

128
00:11:56.000 --> 00:12:01.000
a male child would identify with a father and a female child with a mother and so forth.

129
00:12:01.060 --> 00:12:06.100
In other words, it gives them an anchor or a direction to start to grow into.

130
00:12:08.620 --> 00:12:12.220
And I think of as examples, of course, it's very important.

131
00:12:12.380 --> 00:12:14.440
I mean, in every way in the development of their character,

132
00:12:14.440 --> 00:12:17.100
I believe the child reflects what the parent is.

133
00:12:17.160 --> 00:12:22.780
So I think you're saying here a father and mother, baby is born blank, starting from birth.

134
00:12:23.180 --> 00:12:25.660
He has to identify with a father and mother.

135
00:12:27.120 --> 00:12:32.540
So I suppose this could lead to alternate changing of diapers,

136
00:12:32.540 --> 00:12:34.880
alternate changing of bottle feeding.

137
00:12:35.400 --> 00:12:38.720
You can't alternate breastfeeding, but you can alternate bottle feeding,

138
00:12:39.280 --> 00:12:43.420
which is one of its great, one of the reasons it's so popular.

139
00:12:45.100 --> 00:12:48.260
You mean you just go through life right from the beginning?

140
00:12:49.660 --> 00:12:54.480
Of course, you know, the father is away all day long and so forth and so on.

141
00:12:54.960 --> 00:12:56.620
Is there a division of labor here?

142
00:12:57.100 --> 00:12:57.760
Yes, sir.

143
00:12:57.760 --> 00:13:02.080
I don't think that the father is a second mother by any chance.

144
00:13:02.280 --> 00:13:05.840
I mean, he has a different role than the mother.

145
00:13:06.940 --> 00:13:07.140
Mother.

146
00:13:07.180 --> 00:13:10.540
We'll get the final word on this next week, but you go ahead and talk freely.

147
00:13:10.900 --> 00:13:19.500
Well, the mother has the normal female softness and gentleness,

148
00:13:20.840 --> 00:13:26.780
which help the baby to feel secure and feel that it's loved.

149
00:13:26.780 --> 00:13:32.860
And the father principle difference from this would be that,

150
00:13:34.800 --> 00:13:36.240
well, for instance, he's not soft.

151
00:13:36.260 --> 00:13:39.480
He's probably got a beard and scratches the kid.

152
00:13:39.480 --> 00:13:40.980
Maybe he can climb up it.

153
00:13:44.460 --> 00:13:47.720
He's the one that sets the rules, you might say,

154
00:13:47.720 --> 00:13:50.400
and is responsible for the order of the family.

155
00:13:50.880 --> 00:13:53.080
And although he doesn't set all the rules,

156
00:13:54.740 --> 00:13:58.340
he should serve as the head of the family.

157
00:13:58.500 --> 00:14:00.460
Men were certainly doing a lot of pipe dreaming.

158
00:14:00.760 --> 00:14:05.040
You know, the way this sounds, I bet a lot of people over there are listening,

159
00:14:05.320 --> 00:14:09.960
and this man sets the rules and the rest of the family obey him or the children obey him.

160
00:14:10.220 --> 00:14:13.340
If this were true, of course, you know, we'd have no problems

161
00:14:13.340 --> 00:14:16.040
and we not really have to ask the question why the father.

162
00:14:17.580 --> 00:14:19.860
Let's go a little bit further.

163
00:14:19.880 --> 00:14:22.800
He was talking about economics and making the dollar.

164
00:14:23.360 --> 00:14:24.660
This is a basic point.

165
00:14:25.080 --> 00:14:26.420
Right on the head there.

166
00:14:26.620 --> 00:14:27.760
If an old man doesn't turn a buck,

167
00:14:28.980 --> 00:14:31.500
mama hasn't got the opportunity to provide the nest,

168
00:14:31.640 --> 00:14:34.240
as you were referring to the rabbit a little while ago, to raise the child.

169
00:14:34.640 --> 00:14:40.100
Well, now let's tackle that point and let's see what headway we can make out of it.

170
00:14:40.380 --> 00:14:42.920
Did you want to say something on that point?

171
00:14:43.180 --> 00:14:46.560
I think that what you said about taking the hour off to come here

172
00:14:47.280 --> 00:14:50.760
leads to another point of taking the hour off to

173
00:14:50.760 --> 00:14:52.820
play with the child, to develop the child,

174
00:14:53.340 --> 00:14:57.480
as you see him in your image and he'll see himself in your image.

175
00:14:57.920 --> 00:14:59.800
Then again, from the economic standpoint,

176
00:15:00.420 --> 00:15:03.560
there are many people that came to this country without any money,

177
00:15:04.440 --> 00:15:07.000
got themselves jobs and labored and labored,

178
00:15:07.120 --> 00:15:09.040
even though they didn't have a good standard of living.

179
00:15:09.240 --> 00:15:11.960
Their children went through college and are now doctors and lawyers and

180
00:15:13.620 --> 00:15:16.100
way up in the economic sections.

181
00:15:19.000 --> 00:15:22.140
Let's get this economic point straightened out.

182
00:15:22.780 --> 00:15:26.660
We all agree this is a major responsibility of the father.

183
00:15:26.960 --> 00:15:27.660
Is that right?

184
00:15:28.240 --> 00:15:28.740
One of them.

185
00:15:29.980 --> 00:15:30.620
One of the major, primary.

186
00:15:30.800 --> 00:15:35.320
This is, well, major, prime or one.

187
00:15:36.080 --> 00:15:38.940
Maybe it's one of the responsibilities of the father.

188
00:15:39.620 --> 00:15:44.180
But let us recognize that if this were the only responsibility of the father,

189
00:15:44.980 --> 00:15:50.160
maybe we can work out something in terms of the United States government where

190
00:15:50.820 --> 00:15:57.540
we can handle this by giving adequate money,

191
00:15:57.680 --> 00:16:01.040
bonuses, scholarships, food and lodging,

192
00:16:01.360 --> 00:16:04.480
right from the government, like a social security check in the beginning.

193
00:16:10.380 --> 00:16:13.700
Obviously, there are additional reasons,

194
00:16:13.700 --> 00:16:15.540
but let's all accept this.

195
00:16:15.820 --> 00:16:22.140
And I think that we all feel that this is something we want mothers to recognize

196
00:16:22.660 --> 00:16:25.400
that this is one job we are trying to do,

197
00:16:26.040 --> 00:16:30.460
even if we are maybe doing other jobs as well as we should be doing.

198
00:16:30.620 --> 00:16:31.280
Yes, sir.

199
00:16:31.600 --> 00:16:36.180
This is a somewhat select group, rather handpicked.

200
00:16:36.500 --> 00:16:39.580
I think if you took a great many laborers,

201
00:16:39.580 --> 00:16:43.920
you'd find out that a lot of them have wives that work.

202
00:16:44.400 --> 00:16:48.900
And the man really isn't the sole provider.

203
00:16:49.600 --> 00:16:53.180
And actually, he may actually be a second mother

204
00:16:53.180 --> 00:16:56.580
in spite of his insistence that he's providing.

205
00:16:56.820 --> 00:16:57.560
The mother works.

206
00:16:57.600 --> 00:17:01.380
He sits at home with kids or babysitter and he comes home and cooks.

207
00:17:02.080 --> 00:17:06.340
He may, in our present society, be the second mother.

208
00:17:06.860 --> 00:17:09.200
And although he insists he's wearing the pants,

209
00:17:09.580 --> 00:17:11.440
I'd like to make a quick point here.

210
00:17:11.480 --> 00:17:13.080
We're not that handpicked.

211
00:17:13.600 --> 00:17:15.180
There may be a bias here,

212
00:17:15.440 --> 00:17:20.720
but we're all here in our Sunday clothes and none of us know who the flavors are or not.

213
00:17:21.740 --> 00:17:25.440
But let me make one point about the mother worker.

214
00:17:26.360 --> 00:17:28.980
And I think let's all recognize this clearly,

215
00:17:29.900 --> 00:17:35.820
that there are some mothers working in the lower economic class because of economic need.

216
00:17:36.540 --> 00:17:41.100
And then there are some mothers who don't have an economic need,

217
00:17:42.340 --> 00:17:47.560
who always are, who are also are working, not at a factory, not for money,

218
00:17:48.000 --> 00:17:49.580
but for the sake of the community.

219
00:17:50.040 --> 00:17:53.480
And in both instances, really, we have a parallelism here.

220
00:17:53.480 --> 00:17:57.720
We do have a society where somehow mothers,

221
00:18:00.760 --> 00:18:03.860
for various needs and for various reasons,

222
00:18:04.740 --> 00:18:10.760
leave a little lacunae, a little hole where the father sometimes has to play a role.

223
00:18:10.760 --> 00:18:13.860
And I think we can all recognize that in one sense of the word,

224
00:18:15.540 --> 00:18:20.680
in emergencies, we are kind of a substitute mother, so to speak.

225
00:18:20.840 --> 00:18:26.260
When the mother gets sick or has to go to the hospital or she has to go on an emergency trip,

226
00:18:26.760 --> 00:18:30.520
the father has to step in there as a kind of a,

227
00:18:30.520 --> 00:18:34.800
he's no longer the big wheel, but now he's the spare tire, you know.

228
00:18:35.340 --> 00:18:35.960
Yes, sir.

229
00:18:37.720 --> 00:18:42.920
I believe we all recognize the points that we just discussed.

230
00:18:43.620 --> 00:18:50.140
I'd like to bring up another point here, and that's an understanding of children and the life and

231
00:18:50.140 --> 00:18:51.560
pertains to the whole family.

232
00:18:52.280 --> 00:18:59.840
During the early childhood, there is a certain grade of intelligence that the parent has to come

233
00:18:59.840 --> 00:19:02.220
to the intelligence of the child.

234
00:19:03.560 --> 00:19:07.360
In different phases throughout the life, in your early teens, in your teenage,

235
00:19:07.940 --> 00:19:11.280
and later on when they go to work and eventually get married,

236
00:19:12.040 --> 00:19:16.880
the father, being the right kind of a father, having the understanding that he should have,

237
00:19:17.280 --> 00:19:21.800
would have to change his understanding many times during his lifetime to cope

238
00:19:21.800 --> 00:19:24.700
with the particular phase that the child is in.

239
00:19:24.820 --> 00:19:25.240
Yes.

240
00:19:25.580 --> 00:19:27.800
And I think that's not only important for the child,

241
00:19:27.800 --> 00:19:30.120
it's important for the whole family, including the wife.

242
00:19:30.740 --> 00:19:33.180
Yeah, this is an important point, and I think we'll come back to it.

243
00:19:33.200 --> 00:19:34.320
Now there were some other hands up.

244
00:19:34.340 --> 00:19:34.780
Yes, sir.

245
00:19:34.940 --> 00:19:42.780
Well, on this economic angle, I think that there's more to it than just bringing home the check.

246
00:19:43.380 --> 00:19:45.980
That's a sort of an impersonal action.

247
00:19:46.640 --> 00:19:51.980
For instance, a couple of years ago, one of my kids thought I worked on the railroad because I

248
00:19:51.980 --> 00:19:54.300
took the train to go into work every day.

249
00:19:54.900 --> 00:19:59.880
This was kind of meaningless to him, and the way we work with money nowadays with checking

250
00:19:59.880 --> 00:20:03.640
accounts and so on, it's not like bringing home, the father brings home the cash in the

251
00:20:03.640 --> 00:20:04.840
loaf on a Friday evening or something.

252
00:20:04.980 --> 00:20:07.220
That's, I think an important thing is the-

253
00:20:07.220 --> 00:20:07.940
It can't appear.

254
00:20:08.720 --> 00:20:09.560
Brushing a growler.

255
00:20:10.360 --> 00:20:15.300
An important thing is the management of the money, and whether or not this would be exclusively

256
00:20:15.800 --> 00:20:19.960
the father's prerogative to decide how the money goes is another question.

257
00:20:19.960 --> 00:20:29.180
Well, we're going to get into some, a few rounds on that, but we may as well get this economic

258
00:20:29.180 --> 00:20:30.980
thing, this money thing, add.

259
00:20:31.920 --> 00:20:32.280
Yes, sir.

260
00:20:32.360 --> 00:20:38.240
It is true that the father is the head of the family, but also I'd like to point out that

261
00:20:39.000 --> 00:20:46.500
it should be a group, the mother and the father together, planning together for the child.

262
00:20:46.500 --> 00:20:51.740
In other words, it is true the father makes the money, but I think that you have a better

263
00:20:51.740 --> 00:20:55.280
family life if you plan these things together and work together.

264
00:20:56.020 --> 00:21:00.220
You're talking about an even partnership where the father ends the money and the mother spends

265
00:21:00.220 --> 00:21:00.640
it.

266
00:21:01.220 --> 00:21:01.220


267
00:21:01.220 --> 00:21:03.260
Oh, pardon me, I misunderstood that.

268
00:21:03.580 --> 00:21:06.740
No, I mean actually working out your problems together.

269
00:21:06.800 --> 00:21:07.140
Surely.

270
00:21:07.780 --> 00:21:13.660
In other words, you don't, the father comes in as the head of the house and he rules everything.

271
00:21:13.660 --> 00:21:17.640
You have to sit down calmly as a family, the two, and when your children are older,

272
00:21:17.680 --> 00:21:20.080
you sit down and have family discussions together.

273
00:21:20.600 --> 00:21:22.520
This brings a family closer together.

274
00:21:22.880 --> 00:21:27.680
It has a better understanding for the child and the child has a better understanding for

275
00:21:27.680 --> 00:21:28.260
his parent.

276
00:21:29.020 --> 00:21:31.500
We made some assumptions in this little discussion.

277
00:21:31.500 --> 00:21:35.400
I mean, you just kind of passed it off that the band was the head of the household and

278
00:21:35.400 --> 00:21:39.380
everybody respected this and understood this and believed in this.

279
00:21:39.860 --> 00:21:42.200
We may get thousands of letters tomorrow saying,

280
00:21:43.660 --> 00:21:48.400
It is true, it is true, doctor, that the man is looked upon as the head of the family,

281
00:21:48.620 --> 00:21:54.480
but by the same token, there is some comparison with the mother and the doctor, whereas that

282
00:21:54.480 --> 00:21:55.580
they work together.

283
00:21:55.720 --> 00:21:57.960
The happy family works together as a unit.

284
00:21:58.260 --> 00:21:58.620
Right.

285
00:21:58.960 --> 00:22:03.440
And you forget that you're the head of the family and your wife will also recognize you

286
00:22:03.440 --> 00:22:04.500
as the head of the family.

287
00:22:04.720 --> 00:22:09.980
And that also goes for that little boy or girl when he gets to the age, because the

288
00:22:09.980 --> 00:22:12.820
children watch every movement of mom and dad.

289
00:22:12.860 --> 00:22:13.260
Yeah.

290
00:22:13.260 --> 00:22:16.360
And whatever you do will reflect in them.

291
00:22:16.600 --> 00:22:22.360
If they turn out to have some bad traits, probably it's because sometimes you do the

292
00:22:22.360 --> 00:22:23.460
wrong things at home.

293
00:22:23.980 --> 00:22:28.880
You may say the wrong things to your wife or your wife may say the wrong things to you.

294
00:22:28.940 --> 00:22:30.900
This has an effect on the child itself.

295
00:22:30.960 --> 00:22:36.520
I feel one of the important points you're making there is that I don't want to get in

296
00:22:36.520 --> 00:22:42.960
the trouble now with anybody, but that insofar as you, the man is the head of the household,

297
00:22:43.920 --> 00:22:54.000
really this title in some sense doesn't come to you automatically, because in some sense

298
00:22:54.000 --> 00:22:58.080
to be a head you have to earn the headship.

299
00:22:58.320 --> 00:22:58.860
Follow me?

300
00:22:59.100 --> 00:23:01.000
And you have to be respected as a head.

301
00:23:02.440 --> 00:23:07.600
Now technically maybe we say man is the head of the household and the head of the home,

302
00:23:09.040 --> 00:23:15.020
but if nobody listens to him, if nobody obeys him, if nobody wants to listen to him, if

303
00:23:15.020 --> 00:23:19.980
nobody wants to obey him, if nobody has some kind of a feeling for the role he should play,

304
00:23:20.300 --> 00:23:24.220
he really becomes the head of the home and name only.

305
00:23:24.820 --> 00:23:25.280
Yes sir.

306
00:23:25.880 --> 00:23:28.280
A lot of hands up and we'll try to get you off.

307
00:23:29.220 --> 00:23:36.560
I've often wondered, doctor, if my home and my father's home are typical and maybe some

308
00:23:36.560 --> 00:23:41.840
comments could be brought out on this, I always look to my mother as I think my kids look

309
00:23:41.840 --> 00:23:47.560
to my wife as the first one to run to when their hand is cut, when there's loving touch

310
00:23:47.560 --> 00:23:52.900
needed, where there's a key to the outside world, a question as to where is it?

311
00:23:52.900 --> 00:23:58.820
I feel a need to interrupt the second-note mind, you know, I think if any of us had our

312
00:23:58.820 --> 00:24:04.400
hands cut and there was a male nurse and a female nurse, we'd be running for the woman,

313
00:24:04.480 --> 00:24:05.800
for the female nurse, yeah.

314
00:24:06.960 --> 00:24:12.260
But isn't this generally typical that if you're looking for love as a child, I know,

315
00:24:12.400 --> 00:24:16.940
think back when you were one and when yours now are in need of it particularly,

316
00:24:18.080 --> 00:24:24.560
first thought is of the gal, of the wife, and yet I used to like to climb on my dad's lap,

317
00:24:24.560 --> 00:24:27.540
I know, and let him key me to the outside world.

318
00:24:28.240 --> 00:24:34.000
I never looked to mother as my source of authority on the what's going on out there place in this

319
00:24:34.000 --> 00:24:36.420
wide mysterious outside area.

320
00:24:37.060 --> 00:24:42.100
Well, I think in a general way we can all recognize this point that since one of the

321
00:24:42.660 --> 00:24:50.380
sexes has to go out into the outside world to earn money, this is unfortunately the hardest

322
00:24:50.380 --> 00:24:55.120
thing we have to do, I mean a farmer doesn't have to do too much of that, but in general

323
00:24:55.120 --> 00:25:00.500
since a man has to go out to the outside world, one parent has to go out and the other parent

324
00:25:00.500 --> 00:25:06.660
has to stay at home and take care of the children, there's a certain sense in which she gets to know

325
00:25:06.660 --> 00:25:12.820
the children better and he gets to know the outside world better, you know, and this kind of really

326
00:25:12.820 --> 00:25:21.980
fits in with making them, giving them a kind of a special role which help relates the family

327
00:25:21.980 --> 00:25:25.660
and the growing children in particular to the outside world.

328
00:25:25.920 --> 00:25:26.500
Yes sir.

329
00:25:26.500 --> 00:25:32.560
I believe that as far as cuts and bruises are concerned, either parent can take care of them,

330
00:25:32.560 --> 00:25:33.920
but I somehow feel that...

331
00:25:33.920 --> 00:25:39.140
But he's making the point that either parent can take care of it, so can American Red Cross

332
00:25:39.780 --> 00:25:43.460
trained person, but that's right, what does a child want, child wants mother.

333
00:25:43.740 --> 00:25:50.000
I think a mother instinctively can take care of mental bruises and I don't know where I read it,

334
00:25:50.000 --> 00:25:56.040
but a doctor once said that a mental bruise is as much an affliction as a physical cut,

335
00:25:56.740 --> 00:26:01.540
one of our problems tonight is the seed of it before we get through that the father isn't

336
00:26:02.360 --> 00:26:07.780
producing the mental bruises and the children are constantly running to the mothers to get healed

337
00:26:07.780 --> 00:26:13.700
because this would be a terrible thing if this is what's happening and I'd not be surprised in

338
00:26:13.700 --> 00:26:17.200
many instances without our knowing this is what this is what's happening.

339
00:26:17.660 --> 00:26:20.100
Vice versa surely.

340
00:26:20.780 --> 00:26:25.240
One thing I think that we have to remember as fathers is that we don't turn over everything

341
00:26:25.240 --> 00:26:30.900
besides earning a living to our wives in the sense of education, stimulating reading,

342
00:26:31.220 --> 00:26:36.680
stimulating using some of the facilities in the city like this museum that we play a definite role,

343
00:26:36.680 --> 00:26:42.340
we don't turn that over to the teachers, we've sort of abdicated this leadership role that's

344
00:26:42.340 --> 00:26:46.960
a dynamic role that a father must have, he must constantly earn it and inspire the children to

345
00:26:46.960 --> 00:26:51.580
move on from the day they're born till the day they don't want to listen to them anymore,

346
00:26:51.920 --> 00:26:53.340
I'm sure they will listen to them.

347
00:26:53.340 --> 00:26:59.240
You know it's interesting we're all saying kind of good things but somehow I feel as a leader here

348
00:26:59.240 --> 00:27:06.960
that they are out of joint with reality, I mean I'm a man as well as you are, I know that in terms

349
00:27:06.960 --> 00:27:16.140
of my ego I like to get on certain committees, I like to get certain recognition, I know enough

350
00:27:16.140 --> 00:27:22.260
businessmen to know that under the guise that they're making a living for their family,

351
00:27:22.260 --> 00:27:26.680
they never come home at nights, they attend tremendous number of conventions,

352
00:27:29.140 --> 00:27:38.000
they have really all kinds of reasons and valid reasons why they're never home because really

353
00:27:38.000 --> 00:27:45.980
nearly everything a man does out of the home even making a deal on the golf course with a

354
00:27:45.980 --> 00:27:50.560
with a person whom he wants to sell something nearly everything he does out out of the home

355
00:27:50.560 --> 00:27:56.480
is ordered to earning a living for the family see and and so I don't want you to forget

356
00:27:57.000 --> 00:28:07.280
that in this whole economic issue here granted basically we are earning this money for our

357
00:28:07.280 --> 00:28:14.320
family but if this were our only motivation we'd really have no problem see it's what we do in

358
00:28:14.550 --> 00:28:22.150
of indulging ourselves indulging our egos indulging our needs I'm going to use the word

359
00:28:22.150 --> 00:28:27.350
selfish needs because other members in the family have needs the wife certainly has a lot of needs

360
00:28:27.350 --> 00:28:35.210
she's home all day long the children have needs so let us not be too satisfied about this economic

361
00:28:35.210 --> 00:28:43.570
issue because I think I can speak for myself I think I can speak collectively for all of us

362
00:28:43.570 --> 00:28:55.910
that if we analyzed this whole drive to earn money that this is not as good and pure you know

363
00:28:55.910 --> 00:29:02.790
as it strikes us on the surface because part of the reason we're discussing things tonight and

364
00:29:02.790 --> 00:29:11.490
the answers are coming up is that somehow we feel that we have to give to our children more than just

365
00:29:11.850 --> 00:29:21.050
food and a roof more than what Alcatraz gives we somehow have to give something of our persons

366
00:29:21.050 --> 00:29:28.590
and you know the peculiar thing is this takes time follow me and time is one of our difficult

367
00:29:28.590 --> 00:29:36.250
commodities and so the question I want to open up following your line of thinking is how do we go

368
00:29:37.010 --> 00:29:42.830
about in your case identifying ourselves with our children I think the whole thing revolves about

369
00:29:42.830 --> 00:29:47.310
the development of your own character I mean I think that if you go about deliberately trying

370
00:29:47.310 --> 00:29:53.190
to make your children into a certain mold or a certain way that you may idealize as being the

371
00:29:53.190 --> 00:29:57.770
thing of the future the thing that's necessary in a child that you're very liable to go wrong

372
00:29:57.770 --> 00:30:04.110
because it's too artificial I think that it comes back to developing our own selves and developing

373
00:30:04.110 --> 00:30:09.570
our own sense of values and that the children if you can develop yourself your children will

374
00:30:09.570 --> 00:30:13.970
see this in you and will have a much better chance of assimilating now you're assuming all along that

375
00:30:13.970 --> 00:30:18.210
when you develop your own sense of values these values are good you know a guy may go to married

376
00:30:18.210 --> 00:30:23.010
life and develop his own sense of values and his own sense of values is how to keep on maintaining

377
00:30:23.010 --> 00:30:28.810
the pleasures and the feed him he had as a bachelor so you want to make you want to

378
00:30:28.810 --> 00:30:34.090
excrucate these values of course when you say good that's true now of course that opens a wide field

379
00:30:34.090 --> 00:30:39.450
for us too I mean the discussion of what's good and values and so forth but I of course implied

380
00:30:39.450 --> 00:30:43.490
these values would be good I mean values that would be worthwhile and that you would desire

381
00:30:43.490 --> 00:30:50.370
in another individual possibly well now to get more specific do we all recognize that

382
00:30:51.750 --> 00:30:57.810
being a father is a bit different from being a bachelor

383
00:30:59.650 --> 00:31:06.130
uh that it's just not a matter of money that somehow we have to play some kind of a

384
00:31:06.130 --> 00:31:11.470
some kind of a role and really we haven't really gotten down to this role as yet yes sir

385
00:31:11.470 --> 00:31:19.170
well in the old days in our grandfather's or their father's days the father was a disciplinarian he

386
00:31:19.170 --> 00:31:25.590
was a little austere a little removed from the family but he was definitely a man in every sense

387
00:31:25.590 --> 00:31:30.690
of the word and everyone looked at him in the family as a man maybe through fear maybe through

388
00:31:30.690 --> 00:31:36.930
admiration nowadays the man really wonders whether he is a man I think part of the time

389
00:31:37.450 --> 00:31:43.970
unless he smokes a certain brand of cigarettes and has a tattoo or yeah if he has a certain odor

390
00:31:43.970 --> 00:31:49.030
about him I know the wife misses this that she wants to know that he is a man that's right and he

391
00:31:49.030 --> 00:31:54.590
he may have to take to rather devious means to even impress upon his wife that he's a man

392
00:31:54.590 --> 00:32:00.750
well how do you feel about this yes well uh I think in order to answer the reason I answered

393
00:32:00.750 --> 00:32:07.050
the basic question father you have to get to the point of what is a good father and a good father

394
00:32:07.050 --> 00:32:13.210
doesn't necessarily you don't base it on the uh how much money he's making or how much money he's

395
00:32:13.210 --> 00:32:19.470
bringing home but more on on how much love he's giving the children and how much love the children

396
00:32:19.470 --> 00:32:27.550
are giving him and uh this is basic companionship is one of the things that uh makes a good father

397
00:32:27.990 --> 00:32:31.970
now do you boys want to accept this or not because you know uh I don't know

398
00:32:33.510 --> 00:32:37.830
well tell us about this because this is something about this whole discussion has been a little

399
00:32:37.830 --> 00:32:42.350
bit nebulous in this respect we've been we've been bringing the wife in we've gotten off the

400
00:32:42.350 --> 00:32:45.790
track that the subject was why is the father why the father that's right we've been talking about

401
00:32:45.830 --> 00:32:51.770
mama and everybody else which I don't believe without mama no father without mama no father

402
00:32:51.770 --> 00:32:56.630
all right but nevertheless tonight it's why the father now we talked earlier about this hand in

403
00:32:56.630 --> 00:33:01.470
hand together through life someone has to take the lead whether it's in your own business whether

404
00:33:01.470 --> 00:33:06.110
it's in your own home yes with your wife with your kids where it is and I believe that's the job of

405
00:33:06.110 --> 00:33:10.730
the homeland he's got to do that and I think the children will love you for it I think more

406
00:33:10.730 --> 00:33:14.790
important than the I think the love will come but I think most important will not specify this as

407
00:33:14.790 --> 00:33:19.470
you do this by remote control as he put notices on the bullet for eight o'clock the morning he does

408
00:33:19.470 --> 00:33:25.830
he does it obviously by example by being the kind of a father that now he doesn't by example he has

409
00:33:25.830 --> 00:33:31.690
to be around where the children can see him as an example as much as as much as possible well

410
00:33:32.630 --> 00:33:37.950
if he's never around then the examples don't do any good except it's a bad example no no but I

411
00:33:37.950 --> 00:33:42.810
think that I think all of us are our day-to-day business schedule that's right are different

412
00:33:42.810 --> 00:33:46.290
yeah I may get home at four in the afternoon I may get home at nine o'clock at night when the

413
00:33:46.290 --> 00:33:50.090
kids are in bed I may see them the weekends you may see them in the morning what let's talk about

414
00:33:50.090 --> 00:33:56.310
when you get home when I get home I attempt to no I mean what's your time schedule because my time

415
00:33:56.310 --> 00:34:01.390
schedule yeah usually nine to five when I'm not trying to find five days a week when I no no when

416
00:34:01.390 --> 00:34:06.790
I'm not traveling I miss often weekends I see yeah so my my time is somewhat limited with the

417
00:34:06.790 --> 00:34:14.010
children yeah nevertheless I do find that when I'm when I'm with them I can not command their

418
00:34:14.010 --> 00:34:18.870
love I believe I receive the love that the kids wants to give me as much as I'm with them five

419
00:34:18.870 --> 00:34:24.910
days a week I've seen many I've seen many boys come home at night walking down the street and

420
00:34:24.910 --> 00:34:30.250
the kids is hi dad let him know he's home yeah now is that good well I think the point you're

421
00:34:30.250 --> 00:34:34.890
making is and this is a very valid point all of us make our livings in different ways

422
00:34:36.130 --> 00:34:41.190
uh we're going to remember though in the back of our mind that we can indulge ourselves in

423
00:34:41.190 --> 00:34:46.830
terms of the time we spend home and not spend home I know that a doctor goes to the hospital

424
00:34:46.830 --> 00:34:50.770
he's working all day but really half of that time he's down the doctor's room

425
00:34:50.770 --> 00:34:55.970
bowling around with the boys about a variety of things that doesn't have anything to do with

426
00:34:55.970 --> 00:35:00.450
medicine you know but from the point of view of his home he's out saving lives

427
00:35:00.450 --> 00:35:12.310
um we recognize that uh that uh every man's time strictly and properly speaking

428
00:35:12.310 --> 00:35:18.730
varies in respect to the time he can give to his family see so really the point you're making is

429
00:35:18.730 --> 00:35:28.210
it's the quality of what he does when he has the time that means something and so

430
00:35:28.650 --> 00:35:35.570
well a lot of hands up so we better get I think it's more specific in explaining

431
00:35:36.090 --> 00:35:42.650
why a father are there are males and females in this world husbands and wives well let's

432
00:35:42.650 --> 00:35:49.410
exclude the wives for the time being but a young child who is developing whether it be boy or girl

433
00:35:49.410 --> 00:35:56.190
must have the outlook of both a male and a female if it is a male someday you will be

434
00:35:56.190 --> 00:36:02.510
interested in the female it watches its mother if it is a uh a male child someday it will be

435
00:36:02.510 --> 00:36:08.750
interested in women nevertheless the child uh assuming that perpetual uh perpetual uh

436
00:36:09.750 --> 00:36:17.690
humanity is the force of nature yes uh then they must sometime come across this problem now if the

437
00:36:18.650 --> 00:36:25.910
if the boy has the father to look to for guidance and how to act as a man and if the girl has

438
00:36:26.190 --> 00:36:32.770
a father to look to to find out how a man should act speaking only of the father's angle yes I

439
00:36:32.770 --> 00:36:42.990
think that in uh creating a background a reservoir from which to to select experiences that they know

440
00:36:42.990 --> 00:36:49.230
have been successful with their own parents a father then can teach his child by supplying it

441
00:36:49.230 --> 00:36:55.950
with a the volume of information as to what to do under a specific condition now let me see if I can

442
00:36:55.950 --> 00:37:02.790
state that point and then anybody else wants to speak the growing child the world is composed of

443
00:37:02.790 --> 00:37:09.830
men and women and this is the world the grown child is going to move into now he's going through a

444
00:37:09.830 --> 00:37:19.550
long period where his only chance his real chance his only intimate chance boy or girl to get to

445
00:37:19.550 --> 00:37:28.150
about men and women whom he's going to meet in the outside world is through having a father and a

446
00:37:28.150 --> 00:37:35.910
mother in the home eats with them a good deal of the time uh vacations with them uh spends weekends

447
00:37:35.910 --> 00:37:43.790
with them uh sees television together with them uh goes on outings with them they do a lot of things

448
00:37:43.790 --> 00:37:50.690
together see and this is very necessary to the wholesome development of any young child boy or

449
00:37:50.690 --> 00:38:01.110
girl so let us recognize that uh being a father obligates one it's a kind of a vocation it obligates

450
00:38:01.110 --> 00:38:10.910
one somehow to make yourself available to your children and let's not forget uh the mother needs

451
00:38:10.910 --> 00:38:19.270
this too now yes sir I might uh like to make a perhaps fine point of distinction to what my

452
00:38:19.270 --> 00:38:28.650
neighbor just uh said we fathers tend to think more I would not say of the welfare but of the

453
00:38:28.650 --> 00:38:37.590
interest and the development of our boys and uh my neighbor uh uh phrased it this way that the boy

454
00:38:37.590 --> 00:38:44.290
is looking to the father the girls to the mother I think I like to speak in favor of the girls here

455
00:38:44.290 --> 00:38:54.010
in their relation to the father uh in my way of thinking the girl's picture of the man individual

456
00:38:54.010 --> 00:38:59.690
man but the man of the growing girls growing girls picture of the man is formed by the father

457
00:38:59.690 --> 00:39:06.530
and I think for a growing up girl the father perhaps as the person the way he acts behaves

458
00:39:06.530 --> 00:39:12.750
faces the world neighbors etc is at a certain phase of her development the daughter's development

459
00:39:12.750 --> 00:39:20.850
perhaps more important and more decisive than the mother the mother in childhood yes but I think

460
00:39:20.850 --> 00:39:27.710
the way the girl the growing girl sees the father will very definitely determine her future aspect

461
00:39:27.710 --> 00:39:38.170
of society now let's all repeat this point now so we all see it we don't have uh all of the time

462
00:39:38.170 --> 00:39:44.750
to explore all of these points but what we must see is that for the normal development of a child

463
00:39:45.310 --> 00:39:57.570
boy or girl have to have for optimum development the experience of both father and mother

464
00:39:59.010 --> 00:40:03.070
and there's a little correlate to this because I want to make this a practical point

465
00:40:05.930 --> 00:40:13.330
remember that when the child gets to be a teenager or older they are suddenly bursting into the

466
00:40:13.330 --> 00:40:22.550
outside world follow me now uh men uh trying to orient their children to the outside world think

467
00:40:22.550 --> 00:40:28.990
they play their real role when the child gets older see but I think we have to all of us be

468
00:40:28.990 --> 00:40:36.970
aware of the fact that if we wait too long we're going to lose out because somewhere along the line

469
00:40:36.970 --> 00:40:48.190
we've lost them I mean in a girl's life a father is the only man in that girl's life maybe till

470
00:40:48.190 --> 00:40:56.450
about 15 16 17 18 19 20 but somewhere along that he suddenly is not the only man in the life

471
00:40:56.450 --> 00:41:04.490
as a matter of fact he becomes the second fiddle so I want to re-emphasize that if you believe and

472
00:41:04.490 --> 00:41:11.690
recognize that this relationship is important you have to make hay while the sun shines you have to

473
00:41:11.690 --> 00:41:18.210
establish a relationship and you're using your time quantitatively when it's available

474
00:41:18.210 --> 00:41:24.470
but also qualitatively that is if you can give them a lot of time but if you're restricting

475
00:41:24.470 --> 00:41:30.430
on them a smaller time you make use of this in terms of really establishing a relationship

476
00:41:30.430 --> 00:41:37.230
with the growing infant the crawling child the walking child the preschool child the school

477
00:41:37.230 --> 00:41:45.590
and so forth yes sir you were saying before that the father has to be available when needed but

478
00:41:45.590 --> 00:41:50.550
I think it's a lot more than this this this idea of leadership that was brought out before

479
00:41:50.550 --> 00:41:55.370
I think too often the father resigns the responsibilities of develop the development

480
00:41:55.370 --> 00:42:00.010
of the child to the mother leading the child leading the child to religion leading the child

481
00:42:00.010 --> 00:42:07.830
leading the child in social development when the child goes to church it's go with mama when the

482
00:42:07.830 --> 00:42:14.010
child selection of television programs it's leave it up to mama and I think this is part of the

483
00:42:14.010 --> 00:42:18.810
father's job too this is the well I think this is the point we're all trying to make that the

484
00:42:18.810 --> 00:42:26.690
father has to become in this country a part of the household yes sir doctor may I reiterate my

485
00:42:26.690 --> 00:42:33.250
statements once more I brought up earlier the discussion about understanding one of the points

486
00:42:33.250 --> 00:42:41.090
I didn't emphasize on it too long but misunderstanding a child in an early age and through the various

487
00:42:41.090 --> 00:42:47.370
phases as they grow up will cause the child not to understand the specifically the father

488
00:42:47.370 --> 00:42:52.110
which is the father misunderstands the child is that what you said yes little individual problems

489
00:42:52.110 --> 00:42:58.150
they may have a little story in the morning it may sound very nonsensical if I'm not late for work

490
00:42:58.150 --> 00:43:04.430
I've got the time I can give a good logical answer to the child and I think that builds up a confidence

491
00:43:04.430 --> 00:43:10.330
in the child themselves that my father understands my problem even though it's a little story that

492
00:43:10.330 --> 00:43:15.550
they dreamed up in their sleep at night yes the child builds up confidence he knows he can go to

493
00:43:15.550 --> 00:43:20.210
his father and the father will give him a good logical answer and of course that will develop

494
00:43:20.210 --> 00:43:24.490
as the child goes along with their various problems and they will come to the father

495
00:43:24.490 --> 00:43:30.150
at all phases of life or as if you brush them off and say that's very nonsensical

496
00:43:30.970 --> 00:43:37.090
the story is fantastic the child will lose confidence in himself and eventually lose

497
00:43:37.090 --> 00:43:44.370
confidence in the father yeah well now to throw in something to get a kind of a realistic picture

498
00:43:44.370 --> 00:43:54.050
is it true that many fathers including ourselves come home including myself come home from work

499
00:43:55.730 --> 00:44:02.390
tired somehow we obviously would prefer to lay down on the couch until the meal is ready

500
00:44:03.170 --> 00:44:07.530
we'd like to get at the newspaper we've picked up the late afternoon papers and we're just

501
00:44:07.530 --> 00:44:12.910
absolutely dying to read this and interfering with all of this comfort and pleasure and even

502
00:44:12.910 --> 00:44:20.430
possibly of a snooze is your child or your children somehow recognizing that you're home

503
00:44:21.350 --> 00:44:25.710
want to kind of set up some kind of communication with you and

504
00:44:28.570 --> 00:44:33.710
men traditionally use different techniques those with choleric temperament say don't bother me

505
00:44:34.290 --> 00:44:40.270
or you actually fall asleep and they hesitate to wake you up or you bury yourself behind the

506
00:44:40.270 --> 00:44:49.550
newspaper now this seems to me to be uh uh you know a real aspect of life and all of this talk

507
00:44:49.550 --> 00:44:57.170
sounds very pretty to me but what do you do when you come home tired at night you are no more

508
00:44:57.170 --> 00:45:03.890
interested in answering the questions of your four-year-old child and well i can i might add

509
00:45:03.890 --> 00:45:10.510
to that i have i work very peculiar hours and come home nine thirty ten o'clock at night and

510
00:45:10.510 --> 00:45:15.490
i'm confronted with the same problem particularly when someone has maybe a lot of homework to do

511
00:45:16.090 --> 00:45:21.910
but as i say in understanding their problem they understand their father too when you come home and

512
00:45:21.910 --> 00:45:26.810
you tell the child that you walked her and it has happened in my home the children they understand

513
00:45:27.330 --> 00:45:31.490
well are you going to do this every night no you can't do it every night otherwise like i say the

514
00:45:31.490 --> 00:45:36.510
hour will lose count suppose mama says uh i want to put in the word for mama says

515
00:45:36.510 --> 00:45:44.130
for mama here uh suppose the child is hungry wet uh cut its finger or any one of the half a dozen

516
00:45:44.130 --> 00:45:50.870
little problems have come up none of it's a really emergency can mama say i'm tired child i think you

517
00:45:50.870 --> 00:46:01.470
can understand this uh do you mind waiting for two hours uh you know the mother is a woman who's uh

518
00:46:01.470 --> 00:46:07.770
and i think it's very nice to have that kind of a child who very sympathetically understands

519
00:46:07.770 --> 00:46:15.170
its father when it says i'm tired i'm just wondering whether again um since we have taken

520
00:46:15.170 --> 00:46:24.030
on the obligation of being parents whether we have that this is a strong point we have a right to be

521
00:46:24.230 --> 00:46:31.710
tired and withdraw therefore into our own shell uh and whether the mother has this right to be

522
00:46:31.710 --> 00:46:39.350
tired now i'm not trying to take an excessive position but uh maybe uh there's something more

523
00:46:39.350 --> 00:46:47.470
important to your family than you being tired at a moment when your child is asking you a question

524
00:46:48.150 --> 00:46:53.370
lots of hands yes sir well uh surprisingly enough although i guess we're all in our good

525
00:46:53.930 --> 00:47:02.070
on tv yeah i uh i know you boys are you know this is being taken down by shorthand i know

526
00:47:02.070 --> 00:47:09.690
personally when my wife was downtown on saturday and i'm left with the mob uh saturday is an awfully

527
00:47:09.690 --> 00:47:17.050
long day and i uh try to get them to take their naps feed them everything seems to go wrong

528
00:47:17.610 --> 00:47:22.530
yeah they know what you're trying to do that's why it's going on i'm very relieved when my wife

529
00:47:22.530 --> 00:47:28.510
gets home i keep coming home exhausted from the shopping tip that's right oh your nerves at the

530
00:47:28.510 --> 00:47:35.610
end of the day and i feel like uh thank god it's over yeah and i'm sure that uh it's nice to say

531
00:47:35.610 --> 00:47:43.130
that it's you can entertain your kids but well of course there's an age breaking point there where

532
00:47:43.130 --> 00:47:49.810
basic companionship that one of our men back in the back mentioned before and that's uh when this

533
00:47:49.810 --> 00:47:54.070
day comes along with the wife goes downtown shopping you can always take the kids to the

534
00:47:54.070 --> 00:47:59.830
ballgame work out in the backyard and make an example along with it as to how to get things

535
00:47:59.830 --> 00:48:05.110
done a lot of fathers laughing come on speak up yes sir i believe you got to take the bumps with

536
00:48:05.110 --> 00:48:11.530
the high spots on the high spots i know that your wife is taking this down now and many another

537
00:48:11.530 --> 00:48:16.350
wife which is the unfortunate well she blows on monday nights i look forward to yes yes sir one of

538
00:48:16.350 --> 00:48:23.170
the solutions we found without writing up a policy book to govern it is areas of authority

539
00:48:23.170 --> 00:48:28.210
rather than there being a boss of the family oh no now we're off the boss subject we're not just

540
00:48:28.210 --> 00:48:32.750
talking about what the tide father does when he's home we'll talk about boss next week there are

541
00:48:33.270 --> 00:48:40.430
channels of discussion and if it's arithmetic it's poor pa if it's clothing it's ma there if it's

542
00:48:40.430 --> 00:48:45.950
fix it it's pa there's a certain number of channeled areas where you then become the eminent

543
00:48:45.950 --> 00:48:53.710
source of authority yeah but you act as if you're trying to divide uh i don't know what your

544
00:48:53.710 --> 00:48:59.210
business is you might be an efficiency expert or a personnel man uh that yeah you're having

545
00:48:59.210 --> 00:49:06.010
everything everything regulated in the home a home doesn't operate in terms of a time schedule and

546
00:49:06.010 --> 00:49:13.070
who does this and who does that this is a human relationship where people where love is the cement

547
00:49:13.070 --> 00:49:19.210
human relationships and we're not dealing we're not dealing with the division of labor here

548
00:49:19.210 --> 00:49:26.610
with we're dealing with people's needs normal natural everyday needs need to be loved you guys

549
00:49:26.610 --> 00:49:32.210
like to be loved by your boss i say this hesitantly but you like to be loved by your secretary

550
00:49:34.230 --> 00:49:39.490
you like to be loved in general this is a need a human being has this is the way he's built

551
00:49:39.490 --> 00:49:44.590
biologically this is the way god has created him see and these children have these same needs

552
00:49:44.590 --> 00:49:54.510
so it isn't just a matter of dividing up the work as if this is a problem of certain chores come up

553
00:49:54.510 --> 00:50:00.290
and efficient way of handling them we're talking about an intimate relationship between human

554
00:50:00.290 --> 00:50:06.170
beings see and if you don't know what this means remember what a relationship you had when you

555
00:50:06.170 --> 00:50:14.370
were recording your wife and how much every moment in that period meant to you see you are

556
00:50:14.370 --> 00:50:20.330
engaged to your children and your children are engaged to you you are going through a romance

557
00:50:20.330 --> 00:50:28.070
a love affair see where they expect love from you and you really expect love from them you may not

558
00:50:28.070 --> 00:50:33.150
be expecting at this moment but uh we don't we're not always going to feel the way we're feeling

559
00:50:33.150 --> 00:50:40.590
now when we get to be 50 and 60 and 70 and 75 peculiarly you know we might end up the children

560
00:50:40.590 --> 00:50:48.190
and they may end up the adults follow me so we're dealing now in a situation where we're

561
00:50:48.190 --> 00:50:55.130
concerned about the dynamics of a home relationship and the real cement in that

562
00:50:55.130 --> 00:51:01.670
dynamics the real operative principle is love and the question i'm asking is that when you were

563
00:51:01.670 --> 00:51:09.710
engaged and friday night came up and you hadn't seen your girl for three days you come home from

564
00:51:09.710 --> 00:51:16.210
your office work tired do you say oh heck i'm tired i'm not going out with her tonight or do

565
00:51:16.210 --> 00:51:21.230
you go all the way down to the south side from the north side and travel about 60 miles of course yes

566
00:51:21.230 --> 00:51:29.050
sir doctor how many of us are there that when we come home tired and are asked a question the

567
00:51:29.050 --> 00:51:34.670
questions you're speaking of that do not have a feeling within ourselves that we are shirking a

568
00:51:34.670 --> 00:51:43.410
duty by not developing or spending that time with the child i mean how many of us are there that can

569
00:51:43.410 --> 00:51:49.510
just go ahead and take that nap you're speaking of well i will say that many of us can take that

570
00:51:49.510 --> 00:51:54.070
nap we feel a little bit guilty but we still take that nap with ourselves in the newspaper

571
00:51:55.090 --> 00:51:59.350
well that that depends on the individual again that's no all this depends upon the individual

572
00:51:59.870 --> 00:52:07.350
and i mean how how how but it also it also depends upon what you think your role is and the farther

573
00:52:07.350 --> 00:52:13.030
in the home we've touched the economic question see many of us have made this an end in itself

574
00:52:13.030 --> 00:52:19.730
you just have to read the papers whether it's bankers whether it's hollywood people you know

575
00:52:19.730 --> 00:52:29.190
if you make your end money success getting ahead this is an end that leads to a kind of a sad role

576
00:52:29.190 --> 00:52:38.990
if you are a parent see so uh important problem here is is uh is uh is the kind of attitude we

577
00:52:38.990 --> 00:52:45.350
have to the role we play and if we get the attitude straight now and we see the importance of it

578
00:52:45.350 --> 00:52:53.530
then peculiarly enough we're not tired we're mostly tired uh i may say we mostly withdraw into the

579
00:52:53.530 --> 00:53:01.290
bathroom sometimes to escape the family uh we're mostly tired because this is in a sense a

580
00:53:01.290 --> 00:53:08.950
psychosomatic kind of a thing because we really want to get away from uh from the things that

581
00:53:08.950 --> 00:53:14.770
annoy us but take the tired father and suddenly have some friends drop in from out of town or

582
00:53:14.770 --> 00:53:21.690
business acquaintances and he livens up tears up hops up gets a chair for the guest makes drinks

583
00:53:21.690 --> 00:53:27.070
full of energy and activity and this is what the child sees yes sir there was a child's book

584
00:53:27.070 --> 00:53:33.470
written for adults called a hole is to dig if we use this uh method of thinking and say that a father

585
00:53:33.470 --> 00:53:39.590
is to be happy with his family a father is to worry with his family a father is to love with

586
00:53:39.590 --> 00:53:46.090
could we not then quite well simplify the touch on all the diversified points and say what a father is

587
00:53:46.090 --> 00:53:54.170
by being an indulger with the entire group under his his roof to perform whatever whatever

588
00:53:54.170 --> 00:54:00.870
thing is at hand at the moment tend a wound play with the child love the family yes this is what's

589
00:54:00.870 --> 00:54:06.810
written in the books and our problem is how do we get fathers like ourselves and others to see this

590
00:54:06.810 --> 00:54:13.250
i'd like to say that one of the problems that father had fathers have in general all the

591
00:54:13.250 --> 00:54:18.010
stereotypes that have grown up around the roles and even tonight with people who are thinking

592
00:54:18.010 --> 00:54:24.030
seriously about this you hear a lot of the the conventional ideas about about fatherhood and it

593
00:54:24.030 --> 00:54:28.830
seems to me that if we're going to achieve this and i agree that that is it i i think that the

594
00:54:28.830 --> 00:54:34.110
money making is sort of incidental to the whole thing you know i'd like to i'd like to end on this

595
00:54:34.110 --> 00:54:41.710
point because we have very little time left that money is incidental to fatherhood it's necessary

596
00:54:41.710 --> 00:54:48.810
but it's incidental the poor father the poor family who have a good loving relationship we know

597
00:54:48.810 --> 00:54:53.870
will always make out better than the well-to-do family where there is in love in this home

598
00:54:54.510 --> 00:54:59.950
now we recognize that the father has to be outside of the home a good deal of the time

599
00:54:59.950 --> 00:55:05.390
in order to make a living i want to end with this one note because really we have left out

600
00:55:06.110 --> 00:55:12.550
the mother to some extent and our relationship to the mother the mother for force is a person

601
00:55:12.550 --> 00:55:18.330
who has to stay within the home in terms of those four walls and talk to children all day long

602
00:55:18.330 --> 00:55:28.950
i would say that in this country the mother is the most unappreciated person in the world this is why

603
00:55:28.950 --> 00:55:36.550
and and and like you who need plaudits and appreciation she needs plaudits and appreciation

604
00:55:36.550 --> 00:55:43.290
if he isn't going to get it in the home if somebody says you're wasting your college education

605
00:55:43.290 --> 00:55:50.150
or some father says husband says why don't you go out like the rest of the women and help get me some

606
00:55:51.110 --> 00:55:57.570
attend some of the meetings to me so you can help drum up some business or this is a very

607
00:55:57.570 --> 00:56:04.950
very poor way of expressing but you know what i mean of going out and somehow helping you get along

608
00:56:04.950 --> 00:56:11.890
under the guise that this is going to help the family this is what the poor american woman does

609
00:56:11.890 --> 00:56:18.050
she has to get appreciation if he's going to get it from the community she'll work in the community

610
00:56:18.050 --> 00:56:24.890
if he's going to get it from an activity outside of the home she's going to get it if he's going

611
00:56:24.890 --> 00:56:29.030
to get it from going to conventions with you she's going to get it that way this is what you

612
00:56:29.030 --> 00:56:36.130
demand but realize now your babies are the most delicate instruments that has ever been created

613
00:56:36.130 --> 00:56:43.250
they need they thrive on love you have to be away most of the time your wife has to be home most of

614
00:56:43.250 --> 00:56:52.350
the time and if you don't give her the energy and the power to appreciate uh what she's doing

615
00:56:52.350 --> 00:56:58.310
then she doesn't if you don't give her the love and the appreciation she doesn't have what it

616
00:56:58.310 --> 00:57:03.910
takes to do the job that's necessary to do in order to bring up your children well secure

617
00:57:03.910 --> 00:57:11.390
stable and happy we will now uh continue with this discussion in terms of any way you want

618
00:57:11.600 --> 00:57:11.600


619
00:57:18.260 --> 00:57:25.040
tonight in participating in the first of a series of four discussions entitled the wise of wise

620
00:57:25.040 --> 00:57:30.080
parenthood presented by the junior league of chicago incorporated the discussion has been

621
00:57:30.080 --> 00:57:35.120
led by dr herbert ratner public health director oak park illinois and member of the faculty of

622
00:57:35.120 --> 00:57:40.620
the strich school of medicine next thursday night at eight o'clock p.m you are invited to join us

623
00:57:40.620 --> 00:57:45.960
again when the subject will be why the mother at which time the wives of many of the husbands

624
00:57:45.960 --> 00:57:52.020
that you have heard tonight will participate as tonight's discussion continues in the studio

625
00:57:52.020 --> 00:57:56.980
so we hope will discussions continue among our viewers in the special home groups which have

626
00:57:56.980 --> 00:58:03.420
been organized for this program please send in to channel 11 your summaries and reactions to this

627
00:58:03.420 --> 00:58:09.280
discussion not later than sunday night so that they may be reviewed before next week's program

628
00:58:09.280 --> 00:58:14.140
this material will form the basis of a booklet to be made available at a later date on the

629
00:58:14.140 --> 00:58:19.480
wise of wise parenthood if you wish to form your own home discussion group for the remainder of

630
00:58:19.480 --> 00:58:24.120
our series you may have information and a descriptive brochure by writing a letter or

631
00:58:24.120 --> 00:58:32.180
postcard giving your name and address to parenthood channel 11 box 1100 chicago 90 illinois this series

632
00:58:32.180 --> 00:58:38.500
is presented by the junior league of chicago incorporated in cooperation with station wttw

633
00:58:38.500 --> 00:58:43.000
the del mused on tonight's program was from the motion picture preface to a life